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Elisabeth

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Sunday, February 22nd 2015, 10:36am

Getting "Over" a bad Guru

I would love to hear from anyone out there, either Ex-Y....L, or any other spiritual group. For me personally, every time I attempt to do Yoga again, be it Asanas, or Pranayama, I remember Swami M., and I get totally emotional, angry, bitter, sad, etc, etc. And even though I know that I shouldn't wish harm on anyone, I'd love him to go to hell. Oops. Sorry. But I do.

I've heard on the Net that to get over a bad spiritual experience, is to throw yourself into another one. It's almost like, ok, you got divorced, go and find yourself another husband straight away. Well, it doesn't work for me.

Please, share your feelings and experiences with me, I'd really appreciate it. Thank you, Elisabeth

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Tuesday, February 24th 2015, 9:52am

Be your own teacher.I won't even use the word guru.
Look at thigs without labeling them and just use what makes you feel good.
Basically , reinvent yourself from your own center, from your own understanding, from your own experience.

Do some stretching every day ( few slow sun salutations) , do some cardio exercise too ( fast walk, or some sport , whatever, or very fast saun salutation cycles, whatever). Find some time to meditate, to be in silence , just beeing with your breath and some nice thought from time to itme is good enough.

Love yourself, make what mnakes you feel good, happy, healthy, fresh, strong.

enjoy your own creation

Elisabeth

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Wednesday, February 25th 2015, 2:24am

Thanks. I can't help but associate Yoga with the big fat orange dude, yes, it's a kind of label, isn't it. When I do stretch, I immediately think of my bad Yoga Trip, I should just see it for what it is: It's just stretching, really. And the same with the breathing, I know, I should just focus on the breath, rather than think Pranayama and having orange images in my head, and then going into an angry fit, or a sad mood.
Once the mind has formed associations, it's not easy getting over it. I wish I could "delete" that particular memory from my brain, reset my human computer. Glad you mentioned doing things that make you feel good, and have a calming effect.

Around the Sw, individual happiness was not seen as that important, many close disciples I have spoken to always emphasized enduring situations that made you feel really bad. ?(

Thanks again. I've got to do something, soon, since my above post I've listened and danced to African Drumming on YouTube. That really is totally awesome. Puts me into another state and mood.

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Thursday, February 26th 2015, 1:02am

No one has copyright to strecthing or meditation in the same way that noone has copyright to eating, walking , breathing or sleeping.
SO just ignore those negative thoughts that come when you are doing something that you enjoy. If you focus on the joy of the activity itself , ALL thoughts will fall off, and those negative thoughts too!
So , let me repeat, pay atention to the joy of activity and thoughts will dissapear, just BE in what you're doing 100% and that is when you enjoy your acitivity. No rush, no forcing, just joy.
The best way to refresh your nervous system is strong physical activity in the open air, and then deep meditation-
I guess you are probably confused about the meditation, and you had some bad experiences connected to it , and probably even a wrong technique. Many ''teachers'' teach people to ''meditate'' in a way that they give you some 'special'' mantra and they instruct you to repeat it and to concentrate. It's not meditationm it's forcing your mind and sooner or later will just give you headache, and though it can maybe improve concentration in short term, it will even weaken your concentration in long term. And bliss experience would happen only when your mind gets tired of the repetition ( when you actually dissobey the instruction :)

Try this technique- sit comfortably and just do nithing for at least 5 minutes, just be there, with your surrounding, your thoughts , your breath, your body. Focus on nothing. And then gently introduce one thought, one phrase, in your language, like- " Let there be peace", or something similar, that you like, maybe in your present situation you could use :" I'm leaving the hurt and embracing the bliss".

Don't repeat it like a mantra, just use this thought every now and then, with ease and very very softly, with no intention to pronounce it clearly. Let it be very soft, and only think it when You feel like geting back to this thought.
After a while ( maybe 1 or 15 minutes) you'll notice that your mind spontaneously gets back to this thought as it has become atttracted to it and flows with it . It may change, sound very blurred and soft, and that's perfect. It'll also be pleasant and it'll take you spontaneously deeper and calm your mind. Never force this thought. Let yourself enjoy the calmness that comes from reducing the mental activity.Come back to your thought spontaneously , use it as a substitute for mental activity, you'l notice that from time to time mind tends to roam away from that deep state of inner awakefulness and calmness , and then gently use your chosen 'thought' to bring it back down there. Don't change your phrase each time you meditate, use it for a longer period, because it helps you to go deep faster if you don't change the phrase.
good luck , and enjoy!

If the word meditation upsets you , you can call this practice.. . well whatever you like.
Or you can just play with that feeling/thought, observing that thought -that you are upset - during those first 5 to 10 minutes, just accepting it that you are upset , but not giving it importance and then comming back to your chosen calming phrase every now and then untill it takes over

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Monday, March 9th 2015, 12:48am

I also lost willpower to do most of things I did when I was in the rising orange organization. Very much because of strong negative associations. On the other hand I channel my energy elsewhere as best as I can. And from time to time I check this site to read or write something which is for now the closest thing to satsang or mass for me. Last time I felt really unfortunate I reread the Desiderata poem which gently reminded me of facts of life while calming me down once again.

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Monday, March 9th 2015, 8:38pm

"enduring situations that made you feel really bad"

By the way, maybe because Elisabeth mentioned abusing situations or coincidentally, I must admit I only recently managed to read the complete Shraddha satsang that was once debated on this forum. The satsang could explanain at least part of the described Swampiji's behaviour. I previously argued the rules of its sadistic game. Now I decided I won't comment on it anymore because I feel I should give voice to others. I especially do not want to cause pain to the people that were hurt by the orange organization much more than me.

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Wednesday, March 11th 2015, 9:49pm

Dear Elisabeth,
I am still using some exercises which are suitable for my new exercising program I created for myself, I am practising some breath techniques.
Nothing belongs to Sw.
And I decided to live my life in independence and autenticity. I decided not to allow Sw to influence me at all.
I like the exercise - so I do it. Sw will not delimit my life any more.
I am stronger, I brought my power back from his hands to mine. He has no power over me.

I wish you can enjoy anything you like or is helpfull for you.

Eva

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Monday, March 16th 2015, 8:27am

Dear Elisabeth,
I am really sorry to read your message. Few months after leaving, I felt similar, I have felt used, manipulated, cheated. I was sad and my spirutual life was suddenly empty. To overcome such feelings, I have hardly tried to understand, why I allowed in the name of yoga to cheat and manipulate me. It was hurting! I had to realize all my motivations why I was so deep in YIDL... naivity, stupidity, laziness, desire of miracles, desire of fast spiritual progress. I had to face parts of myself which are not so nice... I had to accept that. Nothing so funny or nice. I felt angry and nervous. Yes, it would be very easy to say that YIDL and Sw. are the cause of my bad feelings. It would be so easy to route all my bad feelings towards YIDL. But NOT: I was the cause of all this situation. I simply have allowed to cheat myself, I had allowed to manipulate myself, I did not want to see what was obvious.

Now, years later, my feelings to YIDL ans Sw are mostly indifferent. Still some my old friends are part of it - so we can meet, talk and like each other, the same way as I like my friends who are fundamental Christians. I have my own spiritual life and they have their own and we usually select another topics for conversation. And for Sw. I feel mostly compassion and sadness - he got chance, he got talent and he totally misused it. He will have to face his karma and it will not be pleasant at all. Evend today, he faces decline and fall of his empire. He faces the fact is is 3rd class guru or maybe even worse. He lives in lies, he pretends daily... He is so chained to so much maja, he must be suffering! It must be horrible! I would never exchange my own free life full of joy with him.

As I was practising yoga last 20 years and just 7 years I have spent in YIDL, when I left, I simply slowly moved to my previous practice. And starting here, I have found a lot of other teachers, other friends, other yoga groups - so I am practising regularly daily, finishing teacher training in iyengar based school and I teach courses again. Now I see that YIDL has helped me to find out what is important in yoga. OK, it would be better to find it in 10 days instead of in 10 years, but finnaly I got the point ;)

So I wish you to find a peace for your troubled soul. You are still full of strong emotions and it hurts you. Maybe it can help you to understand why you are still so angry of Sw. You opened your mind towards him and you give him your confidence with some inner motivation - try to find why this happend. Just to find, to see. No judgement. Just udnerstand. That is beginning of forgive.

Elisabeth

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Wednesday, April 1st 2015, 8:05pm

Dear All,
Thank you for your replies. Was really helpful. The question about what I wanted from him was helpful, why I was interested in the first place. For me, it was to do with my search for my mother on the other side, I had to grow up without her and my childhood was quite sad and filled with physical and emotional abuse, trauma and neglect. Luckily, these days there are lots of accounts of "Near death experiences" on YouTube, and I have strong hope to meet her again "over there". So, thank you again.

I also wanted to mention that Angela's Video doesn't open up anymore, it gives an "error" message and "please try again later".

Love to you all, Elisabeth

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Friday, April 3rd 2015, 10:58am

there were some hickups on google servers , 8|



hope it will be fine soon

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Friday, April 3rd 2015, 7:06pm

OK works fine again. thx for inf.

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Thursday, December 17th 2015, 5:56pm

Why I will never leave my master

WARUM ICH MEINEN MEISTER NIE VERLASSEN WERDE

Es war in Vep in Ungarn. Wir waren einige hundert Schüler in der
Halle, saßen um unseren Meister herum, der mitten unter uns stand
und einen Vortrag hielt.
In der Pause gingen einige Schüler zu ihm, um ihm zu sagen, dass sie
ein schönes Haus ganz in der Nähe gefunden hätten, in dem er
wohnen könnte. Es hätte ein großes bequemes Bett und liege ganz
ruhig.
Unser Meister zeigte sich hocherfreut und sagte: Wenn Ihr für alle hier
solche Häuser gefunden habt, will ich da schlafen.
Bis dahin verbringe ich die Nächte noch hier in der Halle und schlafe
auf dem Boden wie alle meine Schüler.
Einige Tage später als wir zusammen mit unserem Meister in
Meditation saßen, klopfte es an der Einganstür der Halle.
Die Schüler, die dort Dienst hatten und dafür sorgen sollten,
dass niemand stört, waren erstaunt, dass der Präsident der
Vereinigten Staaten von Amerika mit seinen Bodyguards
vor der Tür stand und bat, unseren Meister einmal sehen und
erleben zu dürfen. Da die Meditation in einigen Minuten
beendet sein sollte, unterhielt sich der Präsident bis dahin
mit den Schülern vor der Tür über Yoga und Meditation.
Als die Tür zur Meditationshalle sich öffnete, trat der Präsident
ein, grüßte unseren Meister und setzte sich auf den Boden,
um dem anschließenden Vortrag zuzuhören.
Nach dem Vortrag bedankte sich der Präsident und verließ mit
seinen Leuten die Halle.
Wir waren erstaunt, dass unser Meister seinen Vortrag nicht
unterbrochen hatte, um mit dem hohen Gast persönlich zu sprechen.
Unser Meister muss unsere Gedanken gehört haben, denn gleich
darauf sagte er: jeder von uns hier auf der Erde hat seine Aufgabe.
Aber wir sollten nicht denken, eine sei größer als die andere.
In allen Menschen ist das gleiche göttliche Bewusstsein und deshalb
ist nicht einer mehr wert als der andere.
Ich glaube, der Präsident hat das gut erkannt und deshalb war er auch
so zurückhaltend und bescheiden.

Bei den Intensiv-Seminaren begann die Morgen-Meditation um 6 Uhr.
Wir mussten zum Meditationsraum über die Straße gehen. Vor dem
Raum stellten wir unsere Schuhe in einem Nebenraum ab.
Eines morgens waren wir überrascht, dass unser Meister dort saß
und unsere Schuhe putzte.
Während der folgenden Meditation musste ich an Ramana Maharshi
denken, der die Schuhe der Gäste seines Ashrams putzte.
Heute denke ich auch an Papst Franziskus, wie er alle Menschen
in Erstaunen versetzt hat, als er ein Gefängnis besuchte, um die Füße von
Inhaftierten zu waschen.
Als wir nach der Meditation zu unseren Schuhen gingen, sahen wir
auf dem Boden ein großes OM-Zeichen: unsere Schuhe hatte unser
Meister zu diesem Symbol zusammen gestellt !
Vor einigen Jahren lauschten wir den Worten des Meisters bei einem
Satsang, als unser Meister von einer Nachricht unterrichtet wurde.
Er unterbrach sofort seinen Vortrag und bat uns für einen gerade
verstorbenen Schüler zu beten. Es war Chici, wie er liebevoll genannt
wurde. Dieser hatte unseren Meister vor zwei Jahren verlassen und
einen Brief über ihn veröffentlicht.
Unser Meister erinnerte in seinen Worten liebevoll an Chici und lobte
ihn als einen sich besonders aufopfernden Schüler, der immer sehr
spirituelle Vorträge gehalten habe. Er führte aus, wie Chici vor vielen
Jahren sein Auto verkauft habe, um den Druck des ersten Yoga-
Buches seines Meisters finanzieren zu können.
Er schloss mit den Worten: Egal was einer meiner Schüler
über mich sagt, ich werde ihm immer meine Liebe und meinen Segen
schicken. Auch Ihr solltet niemanden, der mich verlassen hat, verunglimpfen,
sondern in Liebe an ihn denken und nichts Schlechtes über ihn
sprechen.

Eines Tages kam ein "Tsunami" über unseren Meister - zeitgleich
mit dem Tsunami in Fukushima in Japan.
Sieben Schülerinnen hatten schreckliche Dinge über den Meister
im Internet veröffentlicht. Es gab große Unruhe unter allen Schülern
auf der ganzen Welt.
Der Meister reagierte sofort. Er sagte:
Wir sind alle eine große Familie. In einer Familie muss alles
ausgesprochen und besprochen werden. Wir werden eine große
Versammlung machen, die unser TV-Sender im Internet in alle Welt
überträgt, damit alle dabei sein können.
Die sieben Schülerinnen sollen alles, was ihnen auf der Seele
liegt, vor mir persönlich und uns allen vortragen. Dies wird zur Klarheit führen.
Und so geschah es auch !
Wie oft tauchen all diese Begebenheiten und Erlebnisse mit meinem
Meister in meinen Meditationen auf und erfüllen mein Herz mit
tiefer Liebe und Glückseligkeit.
Ich bin so glücklich, einem tatsächlich verwirklichten Meister begegnet
zu sein, der mich führt und dessen Liebe und Segen mich immer
begleitet und der in meinem Herzen wohnt.
Bin ich ein Träumer ?
Nur wenn mein Herz mit Wahrheit und Liebe erfüllt ist, kann es glücklich sein.

Mein Herz sagt mir:
Nicht in der Welt, sondern in mir selbst ist die Wirklichkeit zu finden.

Roland aus Hamburg
im August 2015

freeling

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Friday, December 18th 2015, 8:47am

Translation in English will follow soon

Before New Year English translation will come.
I wish you all a happy Christmas !

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Saturday, December 19th 2015, 1:10pm

Hi Roland,

I've used google translation to read your post and it worked quite well.

I don't understand, however , what's the point of writing 2 pages in German on an 100% English written forum ? 8|
Whoever is reading this forum, obviously understands english, for german you can post to german forums, there was one on XIDL in Austria.

It would be nice if you could edit your post later when you finish translation , and to leave just english version here because all the answers to your post will be in English too. I'm not an English native speaker so I'm not trying to impose my language, just the language of the forum. Thank you.

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Saturday, December 19th 2015, 1:41pm

Now considering your text;


I think it can be summarized in six points ( correct me if I'm wrong) .

1. Your master is humble because , I don't know when, maybe 30 years ago , once he wanted to sleep with his students in the same hall, on the floor. However, I guess, very soon he moved to separate houses his students found for him. Am I right? I might add that he missed his students sleeping with him , so occasionally he invited some of his young female students to make him company, and he was so humble to let them be his mistresses too. Nice man that guru...

2. USA president once visited his lecture secretly and he received no special treatment. Strange story. Can you please tell us which US president ? Poor swampy must have hadn't realised (if this is true anyway) who was the guest- we all know how hungry for the fame and attention he is, trying to nominate himself for Nobel prize or to get into the UN building. Enough to read Roman's descriptions of such events at Millennium peace summit , or to see how regularly swampy takes photos with officials whenever he has chance to do anywhere he goes. Or how nervous he becomes when posing for press photos- check paramliar site to watch him hit his female student in the video of raksha bandhan day.

3. He is a great guru because he has cleaned your shoes once and made an OM sign with them. To me this looks just like an bizarre show off, nothing more.

4. He is a great guru because he loves his enemies and forgives his ex students that they told the truth about being abused. You missed one important fact: HE is the LAST PERSON in the world to say anything bad about the people that took his mask off. He is a hypocrite of the worse kind, trying to ''forgive'' his victims . Such a bullchit!

5. There has never been an open meeting with the abused women. NEVER. He avoided that confrontation, and even proclaimed us all rakshasas - demons! And for some of the women he was telling they are psychos , sick evil persons, and that all is international conspiracy against him.

6. You are so happy, your heart is filled with love and you enjoy your meditations and a fact that you have found enlightened master. You are just and ignorant selfish person that has never took an effort to check what is the truth and just wants to keep living in his pink bubble- you don't love anyone but yourself and your illusion of being special and having a Master. In my eyes you are nothing but a blind slave and I'm sorry for you because it will not be easy once you realise your selfishness and ignorance.
However it would be better to face that moment of truth than to end your life in this matrix of selfdelusion.





Take the red pill.

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